"Grunge" in retrospective.

[sunvalleylaw]

http://www.retroland.com/grunge/?ut...&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=socialnetwork

I was on the older side, about 7 years or so older than most of the band members (but the same age as Matt Cameron). Nevertheless, I, as a Tacoman suburbanite, really related to the music and vibe in general. What appeared to me to be ruination, of the Puget Sound area by the 80s clear cuts allowed by James watts, leading to the death of logging towns such as Aberdeen, coupled with the sprawl and Sport Ute-ness caused by the influx of the influence of California (Californication) and otherwise, made me understand, relate to and feel Kurt’s primal wail and scream. This article nails it when it talks about the marriage of hippy and punk inherent in the ideal. I wore plaid and flannel before, during and long after (still do) the fad. Long live the vibe and ideal.

 

[el diablo]

"Grungers returned to the thing that mattered: themselves. They had parents who worked two jobs, sacrificed their time and attention for material items, but grunge was here, representing Generation X, to tell parents that it didn’t work." It worked, because parents had two jobs and sacrificed a LOT but Gen X can't find their financial azzes from a hole in the ground.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

"Grungers returned to the thing that mattered: themselves. They had parents who worked two jobs, sacrificed their time and attention for material items, but grunge was here, representing Generation X, to tell parents that it didn’t work." It worked, but Gen X can't find their financial azzes from a hole in the ground.

Truth in that. But truth in what they were saying too. One of the big things that made me disconnect from the Boomers (I am on the trailing edge of Boomers, early edge of X'ers) was the way the Boomers seemed to abandon their ideals in the 80's and trade them in for Beemers and white wine.

 

[Jbird]

Ute-ness?

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Ute-ness?

no. Sport-utness. The act of driving Cadillac Escalade AWDs with 20+ inch rims to Costco to buy dog food.

 

[el diablo]

Truth in that. But truth in what they were saying too. One of the big things that made me disconnect from the Boomers (I am on the trailing edge of Boomers, early edge of X'ers) was the way the Boomers seemed to abandon their ideals in the 80's and trade them in for Beemers and white wine.

Boomers came from a highly tumultuous time and just enjoyed a bit of sanity, if you will. And then lost that when they all hit 50.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Boomers came from a highly tumultuous time and just enjoyed a bit of sanity, if you will. And then lost that when they all hit 50.

I did not view the clear cutting of Western Wa, and the way the puget sound area was developed in the 80s and 90s as sanity. Abandoning the ideals of the 60s for rampant consumerism may have been why they lost the illusion of sanity as they hit 50. And Beemers were way overrated at that time. They got a little better later.

 

[bsman]

"Grungers returned to the thing that mattered: themselves. They had parents who worked two jobs, sacrificed their time and attention for material items, but grunge was here, representing Generation X, to tell parents that it didn’t work." It worked, because parents had two jobs and sacrificed a LOT but Gen X can't find their financial azzes from a hole in the ground.

Broad, sweeping generalizations are ALWAYS wrong!

 

[el diablo]

I did not view the clear cutting of Western Wa, and the way the puget sound area was developed in the 80s and 90s as sanity. Abandoning the ideals of the 60s for rampant consumerism may have been why they lost the illusion of sanity as they hit 50. And Beemers were way overrated at that time. They got a little better later.

Too localized. Maybe I have misunderstood grunge, in which case it was pretty shallow. Beemers absolutely sucked in the 80's.

 

[Help!I'maRock!]

I did not view the clear cutting of Western Wa, and the way the puget sound area was developed in the 80s and 90s as sanity. Abandoning the ideals of the 60s for rampant consumerism may have been why they lost the illusion of sanity as they hit 50. And Beemers were way overrated at that time. They got a little better later.

Of course they got better. The cash infusion gave the company back its research budget.

Grunge was ok. To a kid at the tail end of Gen X, but definitely not a Gen Y'er, it was a lot more relatable than the bad hair bands of the late 80s.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Too localized. Maybe I have misunderstood grunge, in which case it was pretty shallow. Beemers absolutely sucked in the 80's.

It originally was pretty local I believe. More or less garage bands from the greater Seattle area (and beyond). What it became nationally has always been a bit of a mystery to me, other than marketing. In that, it may have been shallow. I do not believe the intent and expressions of the local artists, nor their efforts at music, were shallow.

 

[el diablo]

Of course they got better. The cash infusion gave the company back its research budget.

Grunge was ok. To a kid at the tail end of Gen X, but definitely not a Gen Y'er, it was a lot more relatable than the bad hair bands of the late 80s.

I was playing nothing but new blues in the late 80's..Nighthawks, The Fab T-Birds, Little Charlie and The Night Cats, Duke Tomato, South Side Denny etc.
I missed a lot of crappy music.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

I was playing nothing but new blues in the late 80's..Nighthawks, The Fab T-Birds, Little Charlie and The Night Cats, Duke Tomato, South Side Denny etc.
I missed a lot of crappy music.

That was all great stuff too. I listened to a lot of that as well during that time.

 

[jp_nyc]

What it became nationally has always been a bit of a mystery to me, other than marketing.

It was the Fight Club mentality. Millions of young Americans were raised by people whose lives were defined by wars. The literal wars were overshadowed by the cold war, a conflict between good and evil that was going to last either forever or until the bombs dropped and only cockroaches were left. Then the cold war ended, Bill Clinton became president, and suddenly all these millions of young Americans were living in an utterly different paradigm they didn’t entirely understand, and were to young and inexperienced to elucidate or even understand. In the span of a few years the Berlin wall was gone, the Soviet Union was gone, and a seemingly hopeless future was replaced by retirement planning.

Grunge was the angsty and self-absorbed whinge of a generation that were suddenly told they had a future they had not been raised for, and that there wouldn’t any money for it because the “greatest” generation and their children never bothered to plan for it. So I’d say we’re lucky that grunge was really the worst of that generation. Under different circumstances it could have been a lot worse. If the Soviet Union had fallen ten years earlier all those angsty kids would have had to deal with cognitive dissonance in weak economy with a government lead by a senile old b-movie actor and his wife’s astrologer. That could have been really ugly. So as much as I dislike the grunge era, I think we got off lucky with a few years of Nirvana.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

It was the Fight Club mentality. Millions of young Americans were raised by people whose lives were defined by wars. The literal wars were overshadowed by the cold war, a conflict between good and evil that was going to last either forever or until the bombs dropped and only cockroaches were left. Then the cold war ended, Bill Clinton became president, and suddenly all these millions of young Americans were living in an utterly different paradigm they didn’t entirely understand, and were to young and inexperienced to elucidate or even understand. In the span of a few years the Berlin wall was gone, the Soviet Union was gone, and a seemingly hopeless future was replaced by retirement planning.

Grunge was the angsty and self-absorbed whinge of a generation that were suddenly told they had a future they had not been raised for, and that there wouldn’t any money for it because the “greatest” generation and their children never bothered to plan for it. So I’d say we’re lucky that grunge was really the worst of that generation. Under different circumstances it could have been a lot worse. If the Soviet Union had fallen ten years earlier all those angsty kids would have had to deal with cognitive dissonance in weak economy with a government lead by a senile old b-movie actor and his wife’s astrologer. That could have been really ugly. So as much as I dislike the grunge era, I think we got off lucky with a few years of Nirvana.

Huh. Interesting take. Completely different from my experience of it. But interesting take.

 

[DdBob]

I was early twenty's when Grunge took off . The first i heard and bought was a Soundgarden EP "screaming life/fopp", that was 1991 I think. Imo I think that whole scene is as dated as Haight Street nowadays. It really did not hold up. Most scenes do feel dated but i think the grunge one in general really did. I just can't listen to any of it now.

 

[Gary Blanchard]

Truth in that. But truth in what they were saying too. One of the big things that made me disconnect from the Boomers (I am on the trailing edge of Boomers, early edge of X'ers) was the way the Boomers seemed to abandon their ideals in the 80's and trade them in for Beemers and white wine.

Just want to point out that not all Boomers abandoned their ideals in the 80's. A number of us were involved in the Nuclear Freeze movement, fighting against trickle-down economics, and supporting other causes that helped those in need.

 

[wagdog]

I was raising a family and working my *ss off when grunge took off. To me it looked like a bunch of smelly kids who could barely play their instruments. Sounded like that as well.

:rawk:

Rock music, it never changes.

 

[Dogsinplastic]

Haven't read the article yet, but this thread has been an interesting read. There's perspectives across the spectrum; some deep, some shallow, some seemingly still miffed, some detached, etc.

The aesthetics were of least importance (or should have been) as far as the actual music was concerned, but I remembering them being of huge concern to a bunch of folks. Outside of that it was just another "phase" of rock music that was not necessarily sonically new, but was expressing something seemingly "new" to a larger audience.

There were indie bands throughout the '80s that touched on the sounds and themes of the grunge era, but people weren't interested enough. A few of the bands that broke a bit later in that time (Meat Puppets, Butthole Surfers, Sonic Youth, Buzzcocks, etc.) had been around for long time before they got carried by the wave. Seattle and its surrounding areas were already a scene before the music of Soundgarden started to draw more national attention, then Alice in Chains came along and Nirvana totally blew the scene open.

I liked a bunch out of the gate. Soundgarden and Alice in Chains were considered metal and they sure sounded like it, but more like Sabbath than the party rock of the LA-scene. So there were darker and heavier in their way. Pearl Jam even used to get play on Headbangers Ball for a time. And the trash/death metal scene of the '80s covered a lot of the same themes lyrically while also pushing an aesthetic of wearing whatever was clean enough and not thinking about styling their hair.

Just like any other scene and era, there was stuff I like and loved and there was stuff that I did not enjoy a lick of. And some of those things have shifted in the ensuing couple of decades. The main thing that remained was the sounds of the songs. If I liked the music/songs I didn't care about how well they played their instruments, viewing them as merely tools to expression. That said, I never appreciated the idea that it was not important to learn to play well...the two ideas, pure expression and learned musicianship have never been mutually exclusive to me.

 

[jaxn slim]

I turned 10 in 1992, so all that stuff was really just spoon fed to me via MTV and rock radio. It was different from what my parents had always played, and I liked the songs and images. All the deeper stuff about baby boomers and the cold war was completely over my head, but it's interesting to read about now.